There will be lens announcements in November

I consider FOV of 40-70mm as normal lenses on FF cameras. I had in mind something like RF-S 22mm, i.e. EF-M lens being adapted for the RF mount. I don't think it is far-fetched that Canon release such lens. For 32mm I am not so sure.
I wouldn’t call it far-fetched, but I also wouldn’t consider it likely. The market has changed significantly in the 14 years since the M22/2 was released.

Then again, if Canon decides to push more into the vlogging arena (which would probably be a wise thing for them to do), a lens like that would be ideal. The powershot V10 is ~19mm.
 
Upvote 0
With all the RF-S bodies being larger than needed, with the exception of the R7, moving over the EF-M primes isn't a priority. The R8 being so compact and yet feature laden for a decent price indicates to me that RF-S won't get nice things.
Huh? The R10, R50 and R100 are all smaller than the R7. The R7 is about the same size as the OM-1 while these other bodies are all about the same size as the smaller OM-5. (See Camerasize.com) I wonder what the Sigma lenses (plus a hypothetical 50-135 F/2.8 DC DN C) on all of these bodies is going to do to the sales of the R8 and R6-2, especially if there are no small Sigma DG DN C lenses for the R-mount. I own both an R7 and R6-2. I bought the R7 to use exclusively with long lenses with the expectation of using the R6-2 with my EF lenses. The Sigma 18-50 changed that and the 10-18 will likely change it more.
 
Upvote 0
Huh? The R10, R50 and R100 are all smaller than the R7. The R7 is about the same size as the OM-1 while these other bodies are all about the same size as the smaller OM-5. (See Camerasize.com) I wonder what the Sigma lenses (plus a hypothetical 50-135 F/2.8 DC DN C) on all of these bodies is going to do to the sales of the R8 and R6-2, especially if there are no small Sigma DG DN C lenses for the R-mount. I own both an R7 and R6-2. I bought the R7 to use exclusively with long lenses with the expectation of using the R6-2 with my EF lenses. The Sigma 18-50 changed that and the 10-18 will likely change it more.
The R7 is targeted at long lenses and needs to be large enough to balance lenses like the 100-500. All the other RF-S bodies too small for that while simultaneously being too large to count as compact.

While not size related, the R7 has the fastest sensor of the bunch and it’s borderline unusable in ES mode. All other models are even slower :(

So where’s the R8 equivalent for RF-S?
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
Upvote 0
The R7 is targeted at long lenses and needs to be large enough to balance lenses like the 100-500. All the other RF-S bodies too small for that while simultaneously being too large to count as compact.

While not size related, the R7 has the fastest sensor of the bunch and it’s borderline unusable in ES mode. All other models are even slower :(

So where’s the R8 equivalent for RF-S?
So the R10/R50/R100 are simultaneously too small and too large. I'll agree with the too small. The R7 is, to me, the perfect size and weight. All the other models are even cheaper. Life is full of compromises.
 
Upvote 0
So the R10/R50/R100 are simultaneously too small and too large. I'll agree with the too small. The R7 is, to me, the perfect size and weight. All the other models are even cheaper. Life is full of compromises.
My benchmark for compact APS-C is the original EOS M, anything larger than that, but smaller than an R7 is, to me, a useless form factor. I enjoy using the M6II, but that one is also in the too large/too small category.
 
Upvote 0
...

Essentially in all the wildlife reviews of the R5MKII it has been called out. It's all well and good offering an incredible camera but give us some brighter glass that isnt £14000.

The 180-600mm Is £1700, 600mm f6.3 £4000 and a very attractive option. Considering the 200-800 is £2300. The 100-500mm is £3000 both are compromises. Canon dont offer any large focal length primes between F4 and 11 that are in the pro/prosumer market. It's a huge gap and a huge price difference. Canon have shut off the RF mount to third parties who may offer something else. The RF mount is also 6 years young its been a hot minute...

...
Great post. Frankly, I was ambivalent about ordering the R5MKII because of the (lack of wildlife) lens offerings. The MkII addresses almost all (maybe all) the concerns I had with the first generation R5, which was my favorite camera to shoot. Even though I prefer the R5, I purchased an Z9 and Z400mm TC when released because the set is better suited to wildlife photography. I also tried the Z600mm f/6.3 for a week after it was released. It is a magnificent optic within a very desirable price range (often available at $4300 in the states). However, I couldn't rationalize keeping it with my other Z lenses (I also have the 800mm pf), but would love to have a variable-aperture DO lens to mate with the R5MkII.

I don't know what Canon's business case is for producing/not producing competitive wildlife lenses like you desire. I suspect it/they are on Canon's roadmap, but are down on their priority list. Canon always wants to do RF lenses significantly different from the past and competition, so maybe they are working on a 700mm DO lens?

I hope my conjecture is correct and that we see something that targets our market segment--light-weight, high-IQ long primes that are significantly less than $10k in price--in the next couple of years. I'm just not holding my breath.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 3 users
Upvote 0
I hope my conjecture is correct and that we see something that targets our market segment--light-weight, high-IQ long primes that are significantly less than $10k in price--in the next couple of years. I'm just not holding my breath.
It's not unreasonable. We don't know how long Canon will keep up the pace of 6-8 new RF lenses per year. It was looking like they may fail at that this year, but if they do launch the lenses that CR has recently mentioned (28-70/2.8 non-L just rumored today, 70-200/2.8L Z, 24/1.4 VCM and 50/1.4 VCM) that will put them at 7 lenses for 2024...if they can start shipping all of them, since Canon counts lenses when they ship, not when they're announced. But if they do keep up that pace, they're getting to the point of rounding out the 'usual' lenses. For FF lenses launched (apologies if I missed any), we have:
  • 6 standard zooms
  • 4 ultrawide zooms
  • 6 telephoto zooms
  • 1 superzoom
  • 6 L-series primes ≤135mm
  • 6 non-L primes ≤85mm
  • 7 'exotic' lenses (supertelephotos and the 5.2mm dual fisheye that I didn't count with L primes)
  • 2 extenders
In other words, while there will still be 'usual' lenses (e.g. wide/normal L primes), it does seem like it's time for them to start mixing in more exotic lenses, e.g. mid-range superteles (still $3-4K+), TS-R, long macro or macro zoom, fisheye zoom etc.

There were roughly 122 'unique' full frame EF lenses, with unique meaning the count omits the Mk II and subsequent versions of a lens (one went up to Mk V), but for example includes updates that added IS or lenses that are the same except for the AF motor. We're at 38 full frame RF lenses so far, meaning only 1/3 of the EF catalog is represented in the RF mount. I'd interpret that as meaning there's at least some hope for any reasonable lens to come out over the next decade. Obviously, Canon will decide which lenses to prioritize based on their assessment of the market.
 
  • Love
  • Like
Reactions: 1 users
Upvote 0
Smaller lens with same minimum focus distance = smaller dome needed. EF adapter needs an extra extension port always because of +2cm.
Have you seen a patent for such a lens?
It would be nice and would fill the current gap but B&H still list the EF version for USD1300 so at least it is still available to some extent.
A replacement L lens is highly unlikely to be priced at that or lower price. A f2.8 version would be unique though.

I am not sure that a smaller dome would be applicable though. The dome size is related to the ability to do split shots (bigger is better) and edge sharpness.
Ikelite have a "compact" 8" dome with same curvature but lower volume for portability. It is actually 6" width.

Note that the Ikelite port length for the 8-15/4 is only 20mm anyway so pretty compact front to back. You would need to use a long allen key to tighten the screws as it would be hard to get your fingers to the dome with no port at all.

Great that the EF lens can be adapted with the R mount converter (also giving filter options if relevant for you above water).

@neuroanatomist ... what's the website for Canon Japan with the current/obsolete products on it?
 
Upvote 0
It's not unreasonable. We don't know how long Canon will keep up the pace of 6-8 new RF lenses per year. It was looking like they may fail at that this year, but if they do launch the lenses that CR has recently mentioned (28-70/2.8 non-L just rumored today, 70-200/2.8L Z, 24/1.4 VCM and 50/1.4 VCM) that will put them at 7 lenses for 2024...if they can start shipping all of them, since Canon counts lenses when they ship, not when they're announced. But if they do keep up that pace, they're getting to the point of rounding out the 'usual' lenses. For FF lenses launched (apologies if I missed any), we have:
  • 6 standard zooms
  • 4 ultrawide zooms
  • 6 telephoto zooms
  • 1 superzoom
  • 6 L-series primes ≤135mm
  • 6 non-L primes ≤85mm
  • 7 'exotic' lenses (supertelephotos and the 5.2mm dual fisheye that I didn't count with L primes)
  • 2 extenders
In other words, while there will still be 'usual' lenses (e.g. wide/normal L primes), it does seem like it's time for them to start mixing in more exotic lenses, e.g. mid-range superteles (still $3-4K+), TS-R, long macro or macro zoom, fisheye zoom etc.

There were roughly 122 'unique' full frame EF lenses, with unique meaning the count omits the Mk II and subsequent versions of a lens (one went up to Mk V), but for example includes updates that added IS or lenses that are the same except for the AF motor. We're at 38 full frame RF lenses so far, meaning only 1/3 of the EF catalog is represented in the RF mount. I'd interpret that as meaning there's at least some hope for any reasonable lens to come out over the next decade. Obviously, Canon will decide which lenses to prioritize based on their assessment of the market.
I agree with the assessment but I think that you also need to include the EF lenses that are still not end-of-sale for a complete picture of the market.

With a few exceptions (RF24-105/4, RF600/4 etc), Canon has redesigned the RF lenses to add something to the mix giving a choice of EF or RF with different characteristics and price point. Could be size/weight/extension/focal range (unique or extended)/magnification etc with few downsides beside TC limitations.

With the second hand market, then the choice is even better!
3rd party RF access especially for FF would be ideal where Canon hasn't played in previously eg no fast/wide primes in manual focus/EF mount.
 
Upvote 0
New lenses would be great, just to have more of a variety. It would also be nice to have choices of non "L" type lenses as well (price wise). For me, however, I am waiting for the 200-800mm to get back in stock. I am also not a patient person.
 
Upvote 0
@neuroanatomist ... what's the website for Canon Japan with the current/obsolete products on it?
Cameras

Lenses
 
Upvote 0
Cameras

Lenses
thanks... for non-obsolete EF lenses, there are 9 EF zooms, 12 EF primes (including 4 TS-E), 3 EF-S lenses and 2 EF extenders

If my maths is correct => 38 RF and 26 EF = 64 current Canon lenses available + new ones this year. 3rd party lenses (authorised or not) on top.

11 R mount bodies
3 R mount hybrid EOS cinema bodies
2 EF mount bodies

Interestingly, the RP and R100 are the same price @JPY132,000 (~USD900) direct from Canon Japan and exactly half the price of the R8.
Massively different in the US with B&H =>
R100=USD300 (Was USD480)!
R8=USD1300 (was USD1500)
RP=USD900 (was USD1000)
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0
If the 200-500mm f/4 is under $12k, and not much bigger than the 200-800mm, I think I would buy it. If it's closer in size to the 600mm f/4, or closer to 15k I wouldn't. Well if it was $15k and smaller than the 200-800mm, I would probably buy it to be honest but I don't think that's realistic.
 
Upvote 0
If the 200-500mm f/4 is under $12k, and not much bigger than the 200-800mm, I think I would buy it. If it's closer in size to the 600mm f/4, or closer to 15k I wouldn't.
Based on a prior patent and also on a comparison between the EF 500/4 II relative to the EF 300/2.8 II and the RF 100-300/2.8, it seems likely that the 200-500/4 will be about the same size and weight as the RF 600/4. No idea on price, but Canon has not been shy about charging high prices for RF supertele lenses. Wish I had better news.
 
  • Like
  • Sad
Reactions: 1 users
Upvote 0
Yea, I always hope for a miracle but a massive breakthrough on weight seems unlikely. I think Nikon has found a better balance with its under $10k lenses that are not of the same quality as the $15k big white lenses, but are not as slow as the f/7.1 and f/9 lenses canon is putting out. Lenses in the under 10k range that offer f/6.3 etc. Like the 800mm and the various 600mm options from Nikon. For me, and many like me, under 5lbs is a BIG plus, and under 10k-12k is a BIG plus. I think a 4.5 lb (2kg), $10k, 600mm f/5.6 would be very well received for example. Whether it was prime or some sort of zoom.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 users
Upvote 0
Boy am I happy I'm not a Canon-loyal wildlife enthusiast! The lens/system conundrums seem to have made many quite distraught. Canon, please just release all of the big expensive bird lenses already! End this suffering!

I'm almost afraid of the vacuum that would be left on the forums though; what then would people clamor for?
 
  • Haha
Reactions: 1 users
Upvote 0
I'm almost afraid of the vacuum that would be left on the forums though; what then would people clamor for?
Still a reasonable list I'm afraid....
RF50/1.4
3rd party FF lenses
Wide/fast primes and fisheye zoom
Good quality RF-S wide prime/zoom options
TS-R replacements including 14mm
Long macro
2+x macro
R7ii (high pixel density with grip)
R6iii
R100ii (touchscreen, no EVF)
RPii (sub-USD1k)?
R1C
R5Cii
R5s (or R1s)
I'm sure that I have missed a few :)
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
Upvote 0